Date   

OpenChain meeting agenda 6/15

Kelly Williams
 

Hello,

 

Here’s the agenda for our next call on Mon, 6/15 at 9am Pacific.

 

       LinuxCon Japan update (Dave Marr, 15 mins)

       Discuss possible additional APAC meeting

        

       Continue on Etherpad (Team discussion)

       Review G4 “Internal Procedures”

       Start G5 “Certification”

 

Reminder to review Goal 4 – Internal Procedures.  Attached is a clean copy for your reference.  Please use strikethrough text when editing on the Etherpad - http://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/openchain.

 

 

Conference Number: +1 (415) 906-5657 Pin: 88326
UberConference URL: http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

For international call instructions, please visit the website below. Please note you will have to enter the US Conference number as part of the instructions: http://www.uberconference.com/international/access

 

Screen share (if used): go to http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

Thanks,

Kelly

 


Re: OpenChain meeting agenda 6/15

Kelly Williams
 

Hi Everyone, 

 

The meeting minutes are posted on the wiki at https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/openchain/start?&#meeting-materials

 

Let me know if I missed anything or if you have any questions.

 

Thanks!

Kelly

 

From: openchain-bounces@... [mailto:openchain-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Williams, Kelly
Sent: Thursday, June 11, 2015 4:33 PM
To: openchain@...
Subject: [OpenChain] OpenChain meeting agenda 6/15

 

Hello,

 

Here’s the agenda for our next call on Mon, 6/15 at 9am Pacific.

 

       LinuxCon Japan update (Dave Marr, 15 mins)

       Discuss possible additional APAC meeting

        

       Continue on Etherpad (Team discussion)

       Review G4 “Internal Procedures”

       Start G5 “Certification”

 

Reminder to review Goal 4 – Internal Procedures.  Attached is a clean copy for your reference.  Please use strikethrough text when editing on the Etherpad - http://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/openchain.

 

 

Conference Number: +1 (415) 906-5657 Pin: 88326
UberConference URL:
http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

For international call instructions, please visit the website below. Please note you will have to enter the US Conference number as part of the instructions: http://www.uberconference.com/international/access

 

Screen share (if used): go to http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

Thanks,

Kelly

 


Re: OpenChain meeting agenda 6/15

Kelly Williams
 

Attached is the slide deck from LinuxCon Japan. 

 

From: openchain-bounces@... [mailto:openchain-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Williams, Kelly
Sent: Monday, June 15, 2015 3:21 PM
To: openchain@...
Subject: Re: [OpenChain] OpenChain meeting agenda 6/15

 

Hi Everyone, 

 

The meeting minutes are posted on the wiki at https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/openchain/start?&#meeting-materials

 

Let me know if I missed anything or if you have any questions.

 

Thanks!

Kelly

 

From: openchain-bounces@... [mailto:openchain-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Williams, Kelly
Sent: Thursday, June 11, 2015 4:33 PM
To: openchain@...
Subject: [OpenChain] OpenChain meeting agenda 6/15

 

Hello,

 

Here’s the agenda for our next call on Mon, 6/15 at 9am Pacific.

 

       LinuxCon Japan update (Dave Marr, 15 mins)

       Discuss possible additional APAC meeting

        

       Continue on Etherpad (Team discussion)

       Review G4 “Internal Procedures”

       Start G5 “Certification”

 

Reminder to review Goal 4 – Internal Procedures.  Attached is a clean copy for your reference.  Please use strikethrough text when editing on the Etherpad - http://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/openchain.

 

 

Conference Number: +1 (415) 906-5657 Pin: 88326
UberConference URL:
http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

For international call instructions, please visit the website below. Please note you will have to enter the US Conference number as part of the instructions: http://www.uberconference.com/international/access

 

Screen share (if used): go to http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

Thanks,

Kelly

 


LinuxCon NA meeting

Kelly Williams
 

Hi Everyone,

 

There is an opportunity to have a  face-to-face at LinuxCon NA in Seattle the morning of 8/17.  This may be a great  opportunity to advance the OpenChain framework discussion.  Let me know if you are interested in meeting.  If there is critical mass we will try to make it happen. 

 

Meanwhile looking forward to making continued progress on the semi-monthly calls.  Next one on Monday!

 

Regards,

Kelly

 


OpenChain meeting agenda 7/6

Kelly Williams
 

Hi –

 

Here’s the agenda for our next call on Mon, 7/6 at 9am Pacific.

 

       APAC Meeting update

       Continue on Etherpad - http://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/openchain

       Discuss new SP4.5 and G5: “Certification”

 

Conference Number: +1 (415) 906-5657 Pin: 88326
UberConference URL:
http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

For international call instructions, please visit the website below. Please note you will have to enter the US Conference number as part of the instructions: http://www.uberconference.com/international/access

 

Screen share (if used): go to http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

Thanks,

Kelly

 


Re: LinuxCon NA meeting

Lisa LaForge <Lisa.LaForge@...>
 

Kelly, your emails to me are evidently going into my spam filter, don't know why. This is the reason I have not been attending the meetings because I am not seeing the invites. Could you email me at lisa_laforge@... instead? That is my personal email and then I can reforward to SanDisk.

 

I will be at LinuxCon and could meet on the 17th. Just let me know what time.

 

Lisa LaForge

Director, Technology Transactions and Chairperson of the Open Source Steering Committee

Legal Department, SanDisk Corporation, 951 SanDisk Drive, Milpitas CA 95035

 

Office: 408.801.2118 Twitter: @LaForgeJD

 

NOTICE: This electronic transmission may contain information that is confidential and/or protected by the attorney-client privilege or attorney work product doctrine.  This email is intended only for the recipient(s) named above.  If you are not a named recipient, then you have received this message in error; in such case, please notify the sender immediately and destroy this email.  Any copying, distribution, disclosure or other use of this transmission or its contents by persons other than its intended recipients is prohibited.

 

From: openchain-bounces@... [mailto:openchain-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Williams, Kelly
Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2015 12:15 PM
To: openchain@...
Subject: [OpenChain] LinuxCon NA meeting

 

Hi Everyone,

 

There is an opportunity to have a  face-to-face at LinuxCon NA in Seattle the morning of 8/17.  This may be a great  opportunity to advance the OpenChain framework discussion.  Let me know if you are interested in meeting.  If there is critical mass we will try to make it happen. 

 

Meanwhile looking forward to making continued progress on the semi-monthly calls.  Next one on Monday!

 

Regards,

Kelly

 




PLEASE NOTE: The information contained in this electronic mail message is intended only for the use of the designated recipient(s) named above. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you have received this message in error and that any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender by telephone or e-mail (as shown above) immediately and destroy any and all copies of this message in your possession (whether hard copies or electronically stored copies).


Re: LinuxCon NA meeting

J Lovejoy
 

Lisa,

You can change or add your other email address via the mailing list manager yourself, by going here: https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain

As for the invite for the meetings, I think Mike Dolan manages that.  But I can try to forward it and see if that works in the meantime.

Cheers,
Jilayne


SPDX Legal Team co-lead
opensource@...


On Jul 6, 2015, at 12:16 PM, Lisa LaForge <Lisa.LaForge@...> wrote:

Kelly, your emails to me are evidently going into my spam filter, don't know why. This is the reason I have not been attending the meetings because I am not seeing the invites. Could you email me at lisa_laforge@... instead? That is my personal email and then I can reforward to SanDisk.

 

I will be at LinuxCon and could meet on the 17th. Just let me know what time.

 

Lisa LaForge

Director, Technology Transactions and Chairperson of the Open Source Steering Committee

Legal Department, SanDisk Corporation, 951 SanDisk Drive, Milpitas CA 95035

 

Office: 408.801.2118 Twitter: @LaForgeJD

 

NOTICE: This electronic transmission may contain information that is confidential and/or protected by the attorney-client privilege or attorney work product doctrine.  This email is intended only for the recipient(s) named above.  If you are not a named recipient, then you have received this message in error; in such case, please notify the sender immediately and destroy this email.  Any copying, distribution, disclosure or other use of this transmission or its contents by persons other than its intended recipients is prohibited.

 

From: openchain-bounces@... [mailto:openchain-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Williams, Kelly
Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2015 12:15 PM
To: openchain@...
Subject: [OpenChain] LinuxCon NA meeting

 

Hi Everyone,

 

There is an opportunity to have a  face-to-face at LinuxCon NA in Seattle the morning of 8/17.  This may be a great  opportunity to advance the OpenChain framework discussion.  Let me know if you are interested in meeting.  If there is critical mass we will try to make it happen. 

 

Meanwhile looking forward to making continued progress on the semi-monthly calls.  Next one on Monday!

 

Regards,

Kelly

 




PLEASE NOTE: The information contained in this electronic mail message is intended only for the use of the designated recipient(s) named above. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you have received this message in error and that any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender by telephone or e-mail (as shown above) immediately and destroy any and all copies of this message in your possession (whether hard copies or electronically stored copies).

_______________________________________________
OpenChain mailing list
OpenChain@...
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain


Re: LinuxCon NA meeting

Kelly Williams
 

Thanks, Jilayne. 

 

Lisa, were you able to update your email address via the list manager?

 

From: J Lovejoy [mailto:opensource@...]
Sent: Monday, July 06, 2015 12:54 PM
To: Lisa LaForge
Cc: Williams, Kelly; openchain@...
Subject: Re: [OpenChain] LinuxCon NA meeting

 

Lisa,

 

You can change or add your other email address via the mailing list manager yourself, by going here: https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain

 

As for the invite for the meetings, I think Mike Dolan manages that.  But I can try to forward it and see if that works in the meantime.

 

Cheers,

Jilayne

 

 

SPDX Legal Team co-lead
opensource@...

 

On Jul 6, 2015, at 12:16 PM, Lisa LaForge <Lisa.LaForge@...> wrote:

 

Kelly, your emails to me are evidently going into my spam filter, don't know why. This is the reason I have not been attending the meetings because I am not seeing the invites. Could you email me at lisa_laforge@... instead? That is my personal email and then I can reforward to SanDisk.

 

I will be at LinuxCon and could meet on the 17th. Just let me know what time.

 

Lisa LaForge

Director, Technology Transactions and Chairperson of the Open Source Steering Committee

Legal Department, SanDisk Corporation, 951 SanDisk Drive, Milpitas CA 95035

 

Office: 408.801.2118 Twitter: @LaForgeJD

 

NOTICE: This electronic transmission may contain information that is confidential and/or protected by the attorney-client privilege or attorney work product doctrine.  This email is intended only for the recipient(s) named above.  If you are not a named recipient, then you have received this message in error; in such case, please notify the sender immediately and destroy this email.  Any copying, distribution, disclosure or other use of this transmission or its contents by persons other than its intended recipients is prohibited.

 

From: openchain-bounces@... [mailto:openchain-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Williams, Kelly
Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2015 12:15 PM
To: openchain@...
Subject: [OpenChain] LinuxCon NA meeting

 

Hi Everyone,

 

There is an opportunity to have a  face-to-face at LinuxCon NA in Seattle the morning of 8/17.  This may be a great  opportunity to advance the OpenChain framework discussion.  Let me know if you are interested in meeting.  If there is critical mass we will try to make it happen. 

 

Meanwhile looking forward to making continued progress on the semi-monthly calls.  Next one on Monday!

 

Regards,

Kelly

 

 



PLEASE NOTE: The information contained in this electronic mail message is intended only for the use of the designated recipient(s) named above. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you have received this message in error and that any review, dissemination, distribution, or copying of this message is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender by telephone or e-mail (as shown above) immediately and destroy any and all copies of this message in your possession (whether hard copies or electronically stored copies).

_______________________________________________
OpenChain mailing list
OpenChain@...
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain

 


Re: OpenChain meeting agenda 7/6

Kelly Williams
 

Hi Everyone, 

 

The meeting minutes are posted on the wiki at https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/openchain/start?&#meeting-materials

 

Let me know if I missed anything or if you have any questions.

 

Thanks!

Kelly

 

From: openchain-bounces@... [mailto:openchain-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Williams, Kelly
Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2015 10:23 AM
To: openchain@...
Subject: [OpenChain] OpenChain meeting agenda 7/6

 

Hi –

 

Here’s the agenda for our next call on Mon, 7/6 at 9am Pacific.

 

       APAC Meeting update

       Continue on Etherpad - http://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/openchain

       Discuss new SP4.5 and G5: “Certification”

 

Conference Number: +1 (415) 906-5657 Pin: 88326
UberConference URL:
http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

For international call instructions, please visit the website below. Please note you will have to enter the US Conference number as part of the instructions: http://www.uberconference.com/international/access

 

Screen share (if used): go to http://uberconference.com/mdolan

 

Thanks,

Kelly

 


OpenChain

RUFFIN, MICHEL (MICHEL) <michel.ruffin@...>
 

FYI, I am now authorized to contribute to OpenChain in the name of Alcatel-Lucent world wide (sorry it took a while to get all the authorizations). I will try to participate to a meeting soon, but can I have 10 minutes to say, what I think is not ok and what should be done forward

 

Mainly what I think is not ok is that the first level criteria are too strong, you need to have a smoother approach for companies which have not or have a weak governance process in place

 

Concerning additional criteria, I have a lot of ideas that we are setting in place in Alcatel-Lucent

 

My dis-confort with the actual criteria is that there is a mix between low level criteria and high level criteria. In term of steps to reach a good governance process.

 

A governance process should start low: identify people enroll the lawyers, making a basic governance process, ..

Then raising attention in the company, refining the model to address suppliers, customers, outsourcing, …

Measuring the implementation of the process, coping with divestiture, contribution to open sources, SaaS…

 

And in all the process the resources to sustain it must be made available so everything  cannot be done at once.

 

ALU has gone to all this stages and we are still evolving

 

Michel

Michel.Ruffin@..., PhD
Software Coordination Manager, COO - Business transformation
Distinguished Member of Technical Staff

Tel +33 6 75 25 21 94
Alcatel-Lucent International, Centre de Villarceau - France

 


Re: LinuxCon NA meeting

Kelly Williams
 

Hi –

 

For those who missed the call last week, there was a suggestion to meet over lunch at LinuxCon NA in Seattle.  We have the Capitol Hill room reserved from 12-2:20pm on Mon, 8/17 and looking into getting it catered.  Thanks Mike and Kate for helping out with the arrangements. 

 

If you haven’t done so already, please email me and let me know if you are interested in attending and I will send out an invite. 

 

Thanks!

Kelly

 

From: Williams, Kelly
Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2015 12:15 PM
To: openchain@...
Subject: LinuxCon NA meeting

 

Hi Everyone,

 

There is an opportunity to have a  face-to-face at LinuxCon NA in Seattle the morning of 8/17.  This may be a great  opportunity to advance the OpenChain framework discussion.  Let me know if you are interested in meeting.  If there is critical mass we will try to make it happen. 

 

Meanwhile looking forward to making continued progress on the semi-monthly calls.  Next one on Monday!

 

Regards,

Kelly

 


Re: OpenChain

Dave Marr
 

Michel, welcome to the team, and thank you for the input! Are you able to join the call on Monday?  Really constructive feedback that would be good to discuss.

BTW I should note that all participants are presumptively participating in an independent role and their comments are not ascribed to their company/orgs unless they indicate a preference otherwise.

When we get to a version 1.0 perhaps the materials at that time can be brought back to folks' respective companies for discussion on potential adoption.

Dave

On Jul 16, 2015, at 2:30 PM, RUFFIN, MICHEL (MICHEL) <michel.ruffin@...> wrote:

FYI, I am now authorized to contribute to OpenChain in the name of Alcatel-Lucent world wide (sorry it took a while to get all the authorizations). I will try to participate to a meeting soon, but can I have 10 minutes to say, what I think is not ok and what should be done forward

 

Mainly what I think is not ok is that the first level criteria are too strong, you need to have a smoother approach for companies which have not or have a weak governance process in place

 

Concerning additional criteria, I have a lot of ideas that we are setting in place in Alcatel-Lucent

 

My dis-confort with the actual criteria is that there is a mix between low level criteria and high level criteria. In term of steps to reach a good governance process.

 

A governance process should start low: identify people enroll the lawyers, making a basic governance process, ..

Then raising attention in the company, refining the model to address suppliers, customers, outsourcing, …

Measuring the implementation of the process, coping with divestiture, contribution to open sources, SaaS…

 

And in all the process the resources to sustain it must be made available so everything  cannot be done at once.

 

ALU has gone to all this stages and we are still evolving

 

Michel

Michel.Ruffin@..., PhD
Software Coordination Manager, COO - Business transformation
Distinguished Member of Technical Staff

Tel +33 6 75 25 21 94
Alcatel-Lucent International, Centre de Villarceau - France

 

_______________________________________________
OpenChain mailing list
OpenChain@...
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain


Re: OpenChain

RUFFIN, MICHEL (MICHEL) <michel.ruffin@...>
 

I will try to do it next Monday, but not totally sure, I have a meeting with high exec in my company at 11 PDT and need to be ready, since I do the presentation.

 

I am allowed to speak officially on FOSS issues on the name of Alcatel-Lucent since I am in charge of our FOSS governance process since the beginning in 2002.

 

This make me think to a new comment on the criteria, there is no differentiation between small and big companies.  In a big company of 60 000 people with a huge turnover,  a lot of outsourcing, partners, suppliers how do you control the behavior of people. This should be reflected someway in the criteria.

 

Michel

Michel.Ruffin@..., PhD
Software Coordination Manager, COO - Business transformation
Distinguished Member of Technical Staff

Tel +33 6 75 25 21 94
Alcatel-Lucent International, Centre de Villarceau - France

 

De : Marr, David [mailto:dmarr@...]
Envoyé : vendredi 17 juillet 2015 05:41
À : RUFFIN, MICHEL (MICHEL)
Cc : Hutchison, Jim; openchain@...
Objet : Re: [OpenChain] OpenChain

 

Michel, welcome to the team, and thank you for the input! Are you able to join the call on Monday?  Really constructive feedback that would be good to discuss.

 

BTW I should note that all participants are presumptively participating in an independent role and their comments are not ascribed to their company/orgs unless they indicate a preference otherwise.

When we get to a version 1.0 perhaps the materials at that time can be brought back to folks' respective companies for discussion on potential adoption.

Dave


On Jul 16, 2015, at 2:30 PM, RUFFIN, MICHEL (MICHEL) <michel.ruffin@...> wrote:

FYI, I am now authorized to contribute to OpenChain in the name of Alcatel-Lucent world wide (sorry it took a while to get all the authorizations). I will try to participate to a meeting soon, but can I have 10 minutes to say, what I think is not ok and what should be done forward

 

Mainly what I think is not ok is that the first level criteria are too strong, you need to have a smoother approach for companies which have not or have a weak governance process in place

 

Concerning additional criteria, I have a lot of ideas that we are setting in place in Alcatel-Lucent

 

My dis-confort with the actual criteria is that there is a mix between low level criteria and high level criteria. In term of steps to reach a good governance process.

 

A governance process should start low: identify people enroll the lawyers, making a basic governance process, ..

Then raising attention in the company, refining the model to address suppliers, customers, outsourcing, …

Measuring the implementation of the process, coping with divestiture, contribution to open sources, SaaS…

 

And in all the process the resources to sustain it must be made available so everything  cannot be done at once.

 

ALU has gone to all this stages and we are still evolving

 

Michel

Michel.Ruffin@..., PhD
Software Coordination Manager, COO - Business transformation
Distinguished Member of Technical Staff

Tel +33 6 75 25 21 94
Alcatel-Lucent International, Centre de Villarceau - France

 

_______________________________________________
OpenChain mailing list
OpenChain@...
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain


For Monday

Dave Marr
 

Hi, I’ve added a proposed additional supporting practice under Goal 5 (“Certification”) on the Etherpad.  Since it’s an aspect that I don’t think we’ve had a chance to discuss, am providing a preview here so that any interested folks could give some advance thought.  During the call I’ll share the thinking leading to this proposal and hope folks will have suggestions, comments, correction, etc.

 

Thanks,

Dave

 

-----

 

SP5.5 Use of the OpenChain logo is limited to company level designations [NEEDS DISCUSSION...]

 

SP5.5.1 The OpenChain logo is not used until certification is met for a given version

of the specification- e.g., "Company X is certified under OpenChain version 1.0"

 

SP5.5.2 The OpenChain logo is not used on product packaging


Re: For Monday

Joseph Potvin
 

David, I propose the following adjustments to your entry (shown here,
and also in the Etherpad)

SP5.5 Use of the OpenChain logo is limited to company level
designations intended for use in relation to organizations, not
products[NEEDS DISCUSSION...]

SP5.5.1 The OpenChain logo is not used until certification is met for
a given version of the specification

- e.g., "Company X is certified under OpenChain version 1.0"

SP5.5.2 The OpenChain logo is not used on in product marketing
communications packaging must be clearly associated with the
organization, not the product

Joseph Potvin
Operations Manager | Gestionnaire des opérations
The Opman Company | La compagnie Opman
jpotvin@opman.ca
Mobile: 819-593-5983

On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 10:49 AM, Marr, David <dmarr@qti.qualcomm.com> wrote:
Hi, I’ve added a proposed additional supporting practice under Goal 5
(“Certification”) on the Etherpad. Since it’s an aspect that I don’t think
we’ve had a chance to discuss, am providing a preview here so that any
interested folks could give some advance thought. During the call I’ll
share the thinking leading to this proposal and hope folks will have
suggestions, comments, correction, etc.



Thanks,

Dave



-----



SP5.5 Use of the OpenChain logo is limited to company level designations
[NEEDS DISCUSSION...]



SP5.5.1 The OpenChain logo is not used until certification is met for a
given version

of the specification- e.g., "Company X is certified under OpenChain version
1.0"



SP5.5.2 The OpenChain logo is not used on product packaging


_______________________________________________
OpenChain mailing list
OpenChain@lists.linuxfoundation.org
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain


Re: For Monday

Jeremiah Foster <jeremiah.foster@...>
 



On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 4:59 PM, Joseph Potvin <jpotvin@...> wrote:
David,  I propose the following adjustments to your entry (shown here,
and also in the Etherpad)

SP5.5 Use of the OpenChain logo is limited to company level
designations intended for use in relation to organizations, not
products[NEEDS DISCUSSION...]

SP5.5.1 The OpenChain logo is not used until certification is met for
a given version of the specification

So companies going through certification can't use the logo or trademark? That seems a bit restrictive, especially during launch of the overall certification process when you really want to build brand awareness. Perhaps you have the Open Chain logo and you have a "Certified" logo for completing the ISO certification process.  

- e.g., "Company X is certified under OpenChain version 1.0"

SP5.5.2 The OpenChain logo is not used on in product marketing
communications packaging must be clearly associated with the
organization, not the product

I'm not sure this will work. What sort of sanctions do you propose might happen should one claim their "product" as "certified"? You'd have to have some kind of meaningful leverage.

Cheers,

Jeremiah 


--
Jeremiah C. Foster
GENIVI COMMUNITY MANAGER

Pelagicore AB
Ekelundsgatan 4, 6tr, SE-411 18
Gothenburg, Sweden
M: +46 (0)73 093 0506


Re: For Monday

Joseph Potvin
 

Jeremiah,

Of course it's a bit restrictive. Isn't that the point of a certification process and certification mark?

The sanctions, if necessary, would be most directly handled under normal trademark law. But I imagine that embellished or false claims of compliance would carry weight in any case law in which it were to be found that intellectual rights were inadvertently or deliberately violated.

Joseph Potvin
Operations Manager | Gestionnaire des opérations
The Opman Company | La compagnie Opman
jpotvin@...
Mobile: 819-593-5983

On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 11:26 AM, Jeremiah Foster <jeremiah.foster@...> wrote:


On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 4:59 PM, Joseph Potvin <jpotvin@...> wrote:
David,  I propose the following adjustments to your entry (shown here,
and also in the Etherpad)

SP5.5 Use of the OpenChain logo is limited to company level
designations intended for use in relation to organizations, not
products[NEEDS DISCUSSION...]

SP5.5.1 The OpenChain logo is not used until certification is met for
a given version of the specification

So companies going through certification can't use the logo or trademark? That seems a bit restrictive, especially during launch of the overall certification process when you really want to build brand awareness. Perhaps you have the Open Chain logo and you have a "Certified" logo for completing the ISO certification process.  

- e.g., "Company X is certified under OpenChain version 1.0"

SP5.5.2 The OpenChain logo is not used on in product marketing
communications packaging must be clearly associated with the
organization, not the product

I'm not sure this will work. What sort of sanctions do you propose might happen should one claim their "product" as "certified"? You'd have to have some kind of meaningful leverage.

Cheers,

Jeremiah 


--
Jeremiah C. Foster
GENIVI COMMUNITY MANAGER

Pelagicore AB
Ekelundsgatan 4, 6tr, SE-411 18
Gothenburg, Sweden


_______________________________________________
OpenChain mailing list
OpenChain@...
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain



Re: For Monday

Jeremiah Foster <jeremiah.foster@...>
 



On Saturday, July 18, 2015, Joseph Potvin <jpotvin@...> wrote:
Jeremiah,

Of course it's a bit restrictive. Isn't that the point of a certification process and certification mark?

No. It should be about certifying a process that should be widely adopted with the fewest restrictions possible.
 
The sanctions, if necessary, would be most directly handled under normal trademark law. But I imagine that embellished or false claims of compliance would carry weight in any case law in which it were to be found that intellectual rights were inadvertently or deliberately violated. 
 
I think this is completely the wrong approach. The whole point of Free Software is real freedom from this sort of legalistic nonsense. The focus of Open Chain should be in adopting the best practices that exist in the community, not trying to set up some ISO regime that sues people over trademark. Seriously, Open Chain needs to consider policies much more inline with Debian's trademark policy, that will bring the process closer to FOSS practices and out of this maladaptive corporate sphere which really misses the point.

Cheers,

Jeremiah


Joseph Potvin
Operations Manager | Gestionnaire des opérations
The Opman Company | La compagnie Opman
jpotvin@...
Mobile: 819-593-5983

On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 11:26 AM, Jeremiah Foster <jeremiah.foster@...> wrote:


On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 4:59 PM, Joseph Potvin <jpotvin@...> wrote:
David,  I propose the following adjustments to your entry (shown here,
and also in the Etherpad)

SP5.5 Use of the OpenChain logo is limited to company level
designations intended for use in relation to organizations, not
products[NEEDS DISCUSSION...]

SP5.5.1 The OpenChain logo is not used until certification is met for
a given version of the specification

So companies going through certification can't use the logo or trademark? That seems a bit restrictive, especially during launch of the overall certification process when you really want to build brand awareness. Perhaps you have the Open Chain logo and you have a "Certified" logo for completing the ISO certification process.  

- e.g., "Company X is certified under OpenChain version 1.0"

SP5.5.2 The OpenChain logo is not used on in product marketing
communications packaging must be clearly associated with the
organization, not the product

I'm not sure this will work. What sort of sanctions do you propose might happen should one claim their "product" as "certified"? You'd have to have some kind of meaningful leverage.

Cheers,

Jeremiah 


--
Jeremiah C. Foster
GENIVI COMMUNITY MANAGER

Pelagicore AB
Ekelundsgatan 4, 6tr, SE-411 18
Gothenburg, Sweden
jeremiah.foster@...



_______________________________________________
OpenChain mailing list
OpenChain@...
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain



 

 


Re: For Monday

Joseph Potvin
 

Jeremiah,

Please see the OSI's Trademark Usage Guidelines:
http://opensource.org/trademark-guidelines

You might also find the OSI-vs-OSHWA tussel about logos interesting:
http://www.networkworld.com/article/2190402/data-center/open-source-movements-butt-heads-over-logo.html
...this got resolved as follows: http://opensource.org/node/640

You could try to convince people like Richard Fontana, Lawrence Lessig, Eben Moglen, and Mark Radcliffe that trademarks signifying compliance are "legalistic nonsense" in the free/libre/open realm. 

Joseph Potvin
Operations Manager | Gestionnaire des opérations
The Opman Company | La compagnie Opman
jpotvin@...
Mobile: 819-593-5983

On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 10:15 PM, Jeremiah Foster <jeremiah.foster@...> wrote:


On Saturday, July 18, 2015, Joseph Potvin <jpotvin@...> wrote:
Jeremiah,

Of course it's a bit restrictive. Isn't that the point of a certification process and certification mark?

No. It should be about certifying a process that should be widely adopted with the fewest restrictions possible.
 
The sanctions, if necessary, would be most directly handled under normal trademark law. But I imagine that embellished or false claims of compliance would carry weight in any case law in which it were to be found that intellectual rights were inadvertently or deliberately violated. 
 
I think this is completely the wrong approach. The whole point of Free Software is real freedom from this sort of legalistic nonsense. The focus of Open Chain should be in adopting the best practices that exist in the community, not trying to set up some ISO regime that sues people over trademark. Seriously, Open Chain needs to consider policies much more inline with Debian's trademark policy, that will bring the process closer to FOSS practices and out of this maladaptive corporate sphere which really misses the point.

Cheers,

Jeremiah


Joseph Potvin
Operations Manager | Gestionnaire des opérations
The Opman Company | La compagnie Opman
jpotvin@...
Mobile: 819-593-5983

On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 11:26 AM, Jeremiah Foster <jeremiah.foster@...> wrote:


On Sat, Jul 18, 2015 at 4:59 PM, Joseph Potvin <jpotvin@...> wrote:
David,  I propose the following adjustments to your entry (shown here,
and also in the Etherpad)

SP5.5 Use of the OpenChain logo is limited to company level
designations intended for use in relation to organizations, not
products[NEEDS DISCUSSION...]

SP5.5.1 The OpenChain logo is not used until certification is met for
a given version of the specification

So companies going through certification can't use the logo or trademark? That seems a bit restrictive, especially during launch of the overall certification process when you really want to build brand awareness. Perhaps you have the Open Chain logo and you have a "Certified" logo for completing the ISO certification process.  

- e.g., "Company X is certified under OpenChain version 1.0"

SP5.5.2 The OpenChain logo is not used on in product marketing
communications packaging must be clearly associated with the
organization, not the product

I'm not sure this will work. What sort of sanctions do you propose might happen should one claim their "product" as "certified"? You'd have to have some kind of meaningful leverage.

Cheers,

Jeremiah 


--
Jeremiah C. Foster
GENIVI COMMUNITY MANAGER

Pelagicore AB
Ekelundsgatan 4, 6tr, SE-411 18
Gothenburg, Sweden
jeremiah.foster@...



_______________________________________________
OpenChain mailing list
OpenChain@...
https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/openchain



 

 


Re: For Monday

Jeremiah Foster <jeremiah.foster@...>
 



On Sun, Jul 19, 2015 at 4:41 AM, Joseph Potvin <jpotvin@...> wrote:
Jeremiah,

Please see the OSI's Trademark Usage Guidelines:
http://opensource.org/trademark-guidelines

You might also find the OSI-vs-OSHWA tussel about logos interesting:
http://www.networkworld.com/article/2190402/data-center/open-source-movements-butt-heads-over-logo.html
...this got resolved as follows: http://opensource.org/node/640

You could try to convince people like Richard Fontana, Lawrence Lessig, Eben Moglen, and Mark Radcliffe that trademarks signifying compliance are "legalistic nonsense" in the free/libre/open realm.  

I think they'd agree already. You're not going to sue anyone over trademark infringement on a project designed to help someone achieve compliance with the GPL. That's just silly.

Cheers,

Jeremiah

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